Confessed Gamesaver Comes Clean and Speaks Out

Back on March 25th, 2008, Xbox Live's Major Nelson made a formal announcement on his site there was going to be 'Gamerscore Correction' to who Microsoft deemed as the most serious offenders of 'Gamesave Tampering'. They were seen as the worst of the worst violators of the Xbox LIVE Terms of Use, by tampering with their Gamerscore and Achievements.

Major Nelson's Gamerscore Correction Announcement

Their punishment? All of their gamerscore, legit or illegitimately earned through gamesaving was reset to zero, nada, zilch. There was no chance for an appeal, it was wiped out for good. They could begin to earn achievements again, by playing games the way Microsoft intended it to be. Most of the original seven gamers who found their score reset lost over 200K gamerscore apiece and thousands of achievements. Even if 90% were earned legit, it didn't matter. All gone.

In the days and weeks following, xbox.com forums and gaming sites followed the story and debates popped up arguing the value (or non-value) of gamerscore in the first place. Was the punishment too harsh or just right, or should they be left alone? Gamer's paranoia was running wild, wondering if they were subject to a reset simply because they've played offline or for letting their little brother earn achievements on their profile. There was, and is a lot of confusion and mis-information on the subject.

Gamesaving to many is an unknown. What exactly is it? Who would ever do it? And most commonly heard, "Why would anyone do it?" Gamesaving has several forms (which will be described later) and all of them I consider to be cheating.

A website was made to keep track of the gamesave offenders and collects tips on the many more who are still out there. It's run by Xbox MVP aceattorney and is keeping us up-to-date on the latest info on the cheating crowd.

Xbox Cheater Watch

Anyone who knows me or has seen me post on the topic, knows I am a vocal Anti-Gamesaver. I believe gamesaving is a cheap, easy way to earn gamerscore and should not be tolerated by the 360 Community. Even if achievements don't appeal to you in the least bit, it should appeal to your sense of fair play. Gamers should be expected to only obtain achievements if they made the effort to play the game and completed the requirement to get them to *pop* and unlock.

The best analogy I've seen is comparing this issue to steroids in baseball. It taints the integrity of the game and questions the accomplishments of the clean players. The steroid users and their falsely inflated numbers, smack disrespect in the face of the clean players, much like the gamesave crowd does to the 360 Community. When the cheating becomes rampant, pretty soon no one cares anymore. When someone is actually exceptional, the others come out of the woodwork to raise questions, spread rumors and cheapen the accomplishment.

A friend of mine xenocidic, operates the fantastic blog xenocidic.com. A skilled writer, among his many topics, he has written several articles regarding gamerscore and achievements. He has received attention from the legit and gamesaving community because of his Anti-Gamesaving views. It's from here I believe Shuckey found me. My name was linked to one of xenocidic's posts on discovering a tool to help identify gamesaved profiles.


Over a year ago, I engaged in an xbox.com forum debate over gamersaving involving Shuckey. We were on the complete opposite sides of the fence on the topic. A couple days ago he, out of the blue messaged me on XBL. He told me he wanted clear the air on the subject of gamesaving and tell me the depth of his involvement in the gamesaving community. Although I was skeptical of his motive, I invited him to tell me whatever he thought I needed to know.



I recalled his tag had well over 100K gamerscore when I last saw him and was now below 5K. I assumed he may have been reset, but didn't bear the Cheater Watermark on his profile (See the Major Nelson article above for details). He told me he changed his original profile to D3vilz adv0cat3 and made a new account, keeping the Shuckey name.



I told Shuckey I would listen to what he had to say. He quickly responded to my email. I was taken aback with the amount of information he gave to me on the subject, including naming names and personal admission to directly violating LIVE's Terms of Use. Not only is he a gamesaver, but one of the original gamesavers who's partially responsible for the whole process. He admitted to writing some of the gamesaves that spread throughout that sect of the Community. If you wonder who would go through the trouble, believe me there are thousands in the 360 Community who have used gamesaves.

Two things I want to note;
1. During the same debate last year with Shuckey, I met two friends; Stallion83 and Rand al Thor19. Many believe that Stallion83 is the rightful #1 gamerscore champ in the world, and Rand al would be in the Top 10. As you read through Shuckey's email, it will become clear he holds them, especially Stallion83 in disdain. He believes Stallion has gamesaved and is resentful that others see him as #1. I want to say for the record that I DO NOT believe Stallion83 or Rand al have gamesaved or violated the Xbox LIVE ToU. I did not edit their names from Shuckey's email although as their friend, it would be too easy for me to cover for them. Shuckey's opinion is just that, his opinion and though I don't agree with him, he is entitled to it and I left it in this blog, as is.

2. I realize it is a very long blog, but Shuckey's story is a fascinating one. Many gamers picture a guy who would cheat on video games as a pimply-faced, basement-dwelling troll. Shuckey claims to be college-educated, married with kids and former a game programmer. With this article, he's opened himself up to a lot of hate from both sides of the topic. I liken the situation to a former mob boss turning witness for the prosecution. Minus the tommy guns and cement boots, of course. I resent what his actions have caused, but I do respect him for laying it out for all to read.

The following is his email sent to me detailing the history of gamesaving, his role in its origins and names of others involved. At this time, his own gamercard has not been reset, but with admissions to being so intertwined in its activity, that may not be far behind. For the most part it's unedited, in it's full-length glory. Any alterations are noted by me at the exact spot they occur. Here goes.....

"I think before I tell the ins and outs, I will tell my story along with a few other notable names you may know. It really will help to put everything into context.

My name is Marc W. I am 33 years old, married for six years with a two-year-old son. I grew up in a small town just outside of Ann Arbor, Michigan. I went to school at Detroit Country Day High School (graduated 1 year behind Chris Webber if you're into basketball). I graduated with a Bachelors Degree in Architectural Engineering from Purdue in 1996.

This is where the story of gamesaving began .... I went to college with a guy named Rob Gatson. He was a walk-on player for the Purdue Basketball Team and was roommates with Glen Robinson (JD's note: Future #1 overall pick in the 1994 NBA Draft). I met him not at school, but at a Putt-Putt Golf & Games playing Mortal Kombat 2. It was right when Killer Instinct came out. We became friends and since we shared a common love for games, he shared his little project with me since he needed my help.

Rob had purchased a 3D0 Dev Kit for $10,000 dollars using his senior year's tuition to do so. Since 3ds Max is made by Autodesk Media, he assumed I would be able to use it and make 3D models, which at the time were just starting to come about with the launch of the PSX (PS One if you prefer). So I helped him and four other people design a game for the 3D0 that was a BLATANT rip-off of NBA Jam. In the end it was cheaper for 3D0 to pay Rob to make a game for them than to buy our game. So that is what happened...and he brought me with him. I learned how to program C++, Visual C++, Basic, and Visual Basic.

While at 3D0 in San Mateo, CA I met a lot of people who work at other companies since we all worked in the same Industrial Complex (I even worked at Game Pro Magazine also in the same complex as us). I made one game while there, 1996 Decathlon. I saw the writing on the wall and got wind of a job at Midway. So my now roomie, Rob and I both flew to Chicago and interviewed. They only hired him.

One month later, I got the call from Rob to come to Chicago. Midway was changing their whole way of making games and were going 3D. So I was now working for Midway and the first game I worked on was NBA on NBC. We were basically making the same game we shopped to 3D0 since Mark T., the creator of NBA Jam was hard at work. He was about 80% done with the first NFL Blitz, he could not do the B-Ball game which is where Rob came in. They had problems with the camera in Blitz and MK 4 which was about 20% done at the time so that is where I came in (Rob is actually the character Kai in MK 4).

I worked there until the Arcade Division closed, then they sent me to Dallas for a few months until January of 1999. My father got sick, so I did what I had to do and moved home. Things happened and I never went back. My father passed away. I met my wife and decided to stay and work at General Motors in the Engineering Dept with my mom. I took a buy-out last January and they paid for me to go back to school, which I am going back to become a nurse.

So why did I tell you all this you ask? Here is the payoff. During all those years of playing and programming, I collected every video game system and at least 80% or more of each game catalog for each system. For every system I owned a Game Genie, Game Shark, Pro Action Replay, or other such device for every system including my Neo-geo Gold.

I did not buy these things to collect. I used them to be able to beat games and do things you could not normally do (which will also come into play later). I am what you call a compulsive person I do things 100% until I can no longer keep up at the same pace. I want all the cars unlocked in Gran Turismo. I want all the characters unlocked in Soul Calibur 2. I want 100% completion in Grand theft Auto 3. This is just my personality. Am I a cheater? According to the big companies like Nintendo, Sony, and Sega, yes I was, even then.

But I paid $50 dollars for a game and if the learning curve or difficulty were too high or too hard, or worse, the game was super cheap, people in general feel ripped off and did not get to fully enjoy their purchase. Same goes for 360 games. I paid $60 for the game which includes the achievements.

Now comes what you asked and the pay off;

I got my 360 before launch but never had time to play it online due to the fact we were about to have a son and were moving from our condo to our house. But when GRAW came out, I wanted to play online. So in March 2006, I started playing on Live. I played every game that came out and became compulsive about Gamerscore. I have played with CerealKiller5 and StripClubDJ (JD's note: Two of the original reset gamertags)since Xbox days. I became friends with StTheKing because of Strip. I got caught up in the whole Gamerscore group. I actually got a transfer kit because I wanted to do sports rosters without having to do them by hand, just download a save someone else made. I had done it for every College Sports game that had come out on the PS One.

Then the Gamerscore scene got hot when an article about STtheKing, StripClubDJ, and TheGrayWolf hit. At that time, we were all Legit. Then it just got away from us. We let it consume our lives and bury the real gamers we were. Without gamesaves we were still the best.....with the saves, we just had a higher gamerscore number. Then STtheKing started dissing on others when gamesaving and trading began. In reality, ST was eight guys living together going to college, all playing and when they graduated, left the owner of the tag holding the bag without any real gaming skills. Hence no more ST, now he is TV3 TheKing. (JD's note: STtheKing held the #1 spot for gamerscore for most of the first year or so of the 360's launch. Common belief was he was just one person, a college student in Canada).

Then it just became a contest of who could do which game first Legit to make saves. It got ugly with Rance6 becoming #1 by paying people to do his stuff, then it became an all out war.

By the time Strip hit 100k it was out of control and all those awesome gamers were reduced to just a bunch of gamerscore addicts waiting to get a fix. Leaderboards have nothing to do with it, that is the biggest misconception out there. Proof if it were not for MGC (MyGamerCard.net) nobody would know who was the highest unless it was printed in a mag or online somewhere.

During all this, JCnet was a part of the 360GS Community(JD's note: Marc is referring to a website dedicated to obtaining gamerscore through gamesaves, against LIVE ToU), gamesaving and boosting with us. Stallion83 also is a member brought to the site by his friend TheGrayWolf(aka TheLazyWolf). Now JCnet was banned from the site and now he procalims himself the Authority on cheating, yet claims no wrong-doing.

Now (at the time) mind you, Stallion83 is nowhere on the radar and we all have between 30K and 60K. (JD's note: A quick check on the popular gamerscore-tracking site 360voice.com shows on 5/31/06, Stallion83's score was 33,745. On the same date, Shuckey's total score was 10,037) A lot of things changed when Dead Rising, TDU, and Chromehounds came out. First it was just straight moving the game folder into your ID folder on your Memory Card. Then these babies came out and Microsoft was trying to stop us with new security functions. Nothing works, nor will work. Nintendo tried it with the GameShark for the N64 back in the day putting a key code in on Diddy Kong Racing to try and stop the use of the device.

Now as I said, I was one of the original members along with CerealKiller5 , Ang R Wound, and Roofus (aka Sufoor) on the 360GS site. (JD's note: Ang R Wound and Sufoor are two more reset gamertags) Now I can not tell you specifics on what the Resigner is nor how it does what it does, only what it can do.

The last Fall Dashboard Update stopped 80% of all gamesaving because it required an offline non-updated box. But the Resigner changes all that, thanks to me which is what I eluded to earlier.

I also, by knowing how the non-updated boxes were able to "resign" saves so they now became yours. You could use them no matter what so the Resigner was thought of, developed and then implemented. It works by removing half the data that was the other persons ID from the save then infusing your ID with the save, making it yours.

I do not condone hacking games because at least with a save, someone did it legit at some point. Hacks at first were done without having dates, then they found the key to putting on dates. Now they can put any date on they want and can make a tag look 100% Legit if they took the time to do it, which I doubt they would really do. But if MS keeps doing this to people I think one of the three programmers from the site will do just that. (JD's note: Who are they???)

There are different types of gamesaving and different methods...

(JD's EDIT: After each description, Marc gives a game-specific example or two on how this is accomplished. I've decided to omit these examples. I couldn't with a clear conscious be decidedly anti-gamesaving, yet leave in exact step-by-step ways to do so for all to see. I read through them carefully and his examples make perfect sense, so I believe they do in fact work. Marc, I'm sure you understand.)

A. Folder Transfer...easy enough, a straight folder. Move from your Profile ID folder to mine. I then would do set specific tasks or do 1 thing to unlock a certain amount from a 1000 save.
(examples removed)
B. Profile Bypass.....take save and change your profile ID to saves owner's ID to use their save.
(examples removed)
C. Resigned Saves.....modify save using Resigner so it's ownership is yours to use.
(examples removed)
D. Second Profile Glitch......using ones profile statistics to get achievements with or without a save present.
Examples......... (JD's EDIT: game title removed)

1. Take Source Profile. Let's say, "BobbyJo" is the gamertag.
2. Load profile on Controller 1.
3. Then load BobbyJo up. During Load screen, click 'sign-on' with Controller 2.
4. When profile list shows up, do not touch Controller 2, instead scroll down on Controller 1 and select profile you want achievements on. All of this is done during the loading screen.
5. (JD's EDIT: I removed the last step as it was game-specific).

This is just a taste of what gamesaving is, how it became what it is, and why some of us, not most of us did it to begin with. Most of us were the best players in the world and competition, just like in professional sports destroyed us all. Now people think we are just a bunch of losers who just load up a save someone gave us and get 1000 in something without having to do the game. Some do, most do not......which is why BF2 is not done by many...you would still have to be good enough to get it legit in the first place to use my saves for BF2 Exemplary... I did that on purpose to keep noobs from using the saves to get super hard achievements.

But there will always be the exception and the two standards even we gamesavers respect and admire........F.E.A.R. 1000 has to be done 100% Legit. F.E.A.R. Files has to be done 100% LegitChromehounds........anybody who has 800 - 1000 in it. Because it must be done Legit Online there is no Boosting per say.

BTW a little side note, using your Time tool Grease Monkey I was able to see Stallion also gamesaved Bullet Witch both versions (actually he did not do it, FuryDog did it for him) (JD's note: FuryDog has since posted a comment here denying that statement) Stallion's other gamesaving buddy, along with TheGrayWolf (aka TheLazyWolf) . Also of note Strip asked to be removed from the MGC Leaderboards and Morgan(MGC.net's site administrator and xbox MVP)would not do it....causing even more problems for everyone. (JD's note: This is the part I was talking about. This is Marc's opinion only. Stallion for the record, denied this and I find no evidence to back up Marc's claim regarding FuryDog).

My take on the whole thing is this....I could care less what people do or don't cheat....it's their time and their choice. Me, gamesaving anything does not impead on anybody's fun on Xbox Live. Me going into a Ranked Gears game and hearing a 12 year old kid say "Achievement Match, this is for achievements if you are not going to do it leave now." That hurts my fun on Xbox Live. People boosting in a game or better yet kicking you out of a game because they are boosting impeads on my experience on Live in a derogatory manner.

If it were not for sites like MGC.net nobody would care. The other more pathetic individuals are those who cheat themselves and claim to be 100% Legit....take credit for things that they never did themsleves and to put others down that do the same things they do. Stallion83, Zakk Wylde, Rand al Thor, Omega Deez, and Jcnet.....all have gamesaved, all have cheated, all send hate mail via Xbox Live to people who have what they can not get. (JD's note: Again, all opinion, nothing factual at this time. Expect follow-up in a future blog entry).

"Do not covet what thy neighbor posseses." Or better yet"People Will Always Talk About You, Especially When They Envy You And The Life You Live. Let Them, You Affected Their Life.... They Did Not Affect Yours."

Good words to live by...you see, I do not seek attention. I was not at the top of the Leaderboards. I did not hack achievements. I do not care about these things. My Clan and I are one of the Best and Most respected Clans on Live. So I do not need a site to be on my excuse the harshness but nuts and brag about being the first 100k when he clearly was like 32nd. And the first Legit 200k which again he was clearly not. I am about the truth, not a kid who says he's 24, married, works 2 -16 hours a day and has 200k Legit.

Now do the math .... I was 20k higher than him when he hit 100k(JD's note: Using 360voice.com again, shows on March 31st, 2007, the day he broke 100K, Stallion83's gamerscore was 100,231. On the same date, Shuckey's overall score was 91,871 almost 10K behind, not 20K ahead)....... I work at home and can stay up all night long. I have eight US 360's and eight copies of almost every game. I trade, I gamesave, I play Legit all at the same time.....maybe even having multiple people doing games all while doing Legit and gamesaves. He passed me like I was standing still and caught up to Cerealkiller5 in less than a year.....and you still would have me believe he is Legit? This is just sheer observation....but then I know what I know, combined with Greasemonkey (awesome tool BTW) and I can tell anybody who gamesaved. The proof is staring you right in the eye and no site will post it..... and especially coming from a gamesaver.

But from someone like you..... they would see the truth ..... not just because it's what I would like seen done to a like him....but because it is the truth and it is what's right. Cereal and I are now 100% Legit and the feeling can not be described..... now i can show everyone that I was good enough to get what I had Legit I just got greedy.

I thank you for your time. I am highly educated and so is Casey, aka Cereal who is really a cancer research scientist with a PhD. So we do have lives. We are educated with wives and children, another common misconception.

Marc W."

I just want to reinforce this is Shuckey's story in his words. I'm not implying everything he says above is fact. I have not done a background check or double-checked his statements for absolute truth. I just reprinted what he sent me, with him knowing beforehand it was going to be used in an article.

Whew! Quite long, but very informative. If you've gotten to this part of the article, you've either skipped to the end to read comments, or were hardcore enough to take it all in. I will not allow this to become a flame-fest, keep your comments civil or they will be removed.